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Post by rockymtblue2 on Jun 29, 2021 8:51:52 GMT -5
A just released article by The Athletic savages Hillsman for bullying, inappropriate contact and more. Alas I'm still not willing to subscribe. Do you? Love to have the details on the article.
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Post by bulkey on Jun 29, 2021 9:07:20 GMT -5
www.si.com/college/syracuse/basketball/mangakahia-responds-allegations-quentin-hillsman-syracuseAllegations in the report from The Athletic included the following: -Hillsman threatening players that he would "f--- you guys up" even though they knew he would never physically harm them. -Standing before every player at halftime of a game during the 2019-20 season and saying "I don't give a f--- about you" before flipping over a table. -Hillsman coming up behind a player, wrapping his arms around her with his hands placed near her pelvic region. -Three women felt uncomfortable after Hillsman kissed them on the forehead following a discussion about playing time. -Hired a longtime friend, Ronnie Enoch, who had been accused of sexual harassment at a previous job. Enoch allegedly made players and managers feel uncomfortable. -Two players described instances where Hillsman refused to provide water to players after running punishing sprints. And not the first time: www.syracuse.com/orangewomen/2011/01/former_player_accuses_syracuse.html
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2021 9:30:03 GMT -5
www.si.com/college/syracuse/basketball/mangakahia-responds-allegations-quentin-hillsman-syracuseAllegations in the report from The Athletic included the following: -Hillsman threatening players that he would "f--- you guys up" even though they knew he would never physically harm them. -Standing before every player at halftime of a game during the 2019-20 season and saying "I don't give a f--- about you" before flipping over a table. -Hillsman coming up behind a player, wrapping his arms around her with his hands placed near her pelvic region. -Three women felt uncomfortable after Hillsman kissed them on the forehead following a discussion about playing time. -Hired a longtime friend, Ronnie Enoch, who had been accused of sexual harassment at a previous job. Enoch allegedly made players and managers feel uncomfortable. -Two players described instances where Hillsman refused to provide water to players after running punishing sprints. And not the first time: www.syracuse.com/orangewomen/2011/01/former_player_accuses_syracuse.html All of that and still no NCAA Title? How not to coach!! |
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Post by rockymtblue2 on Jun 29, 2021 9:35:07 GMT -5
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Post by grrrrr on Jun 29, 2021 12:08:08 GMT -5
I don't subscribe either but the Cliff Notes version on Yahoo and ESPN are enough to make your skin crawl. He's not eccentric, he's mentally ill. How could he ever recruit anyone to play for him is beyond me. Thanks for the links you guys. OMG.
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Post by grrrrr on Jun 29, 2021 12:36:17 GMT -5
Just listened to the podcast, what a cesspool. The two authors did an amazing job with the story, they said they had to cover it with the two of them because they had so many people to talk to. Loony Toons is lucky he works for Sgt. Schultz but after this, hopefully the luck will have run out.
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Post by knightsbridgeaz on Jun 29, 2021 13:22:42 GMT -5
I don't subscribe either but the Cliff Notes version on Yahoo and ESPN are enough to make your skin crawl. He's not eccentric, he's mentally ill. How could he ever recruit anyone to play for him is beyond me. Thanks for the links you guys. OMG. I subscribe - they got me with coverage of Arizona's Final Four run. That said, they didn't highlight this article in the e-mail I get so I never saw it. I subscribe but don't read regularly. As to Q - he is eccentric. That is not mutually exclusive from having other issues. He seemed singularly unlikeable even before this ugh came out, especially because a part of what he was reputed to be odd about includes a (Christian) religious component. I get that many programs, probably not excluding Rutgers, have some of it, but what I read (and have forgotten) did seem "over the top". |
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Post by knightsbridgeaz on Jun 29, 2021 13:35:31 GMT -5
Oh, and I just read the article. Other than a lot of details about the assistant and his history (he sounds like a real loony, BTW) the essence is captured by the other contents. Best summed up by Q reportedly commenting "I'm a Star" and pounding his chest. Oh Yuck.
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Post by rockymtblue2 on Jun 29, 2021 13:38:13 GMT -5
Another "quirk" of Quentin's reported in the podcast was his insistence that no assistants board a team bus until he did AND one of them had to carry a towel onto the bus and place it at his seat so he could take off his shoes without putting his feet on the bus floor.
I always felt this guy was narcissistic but maybe megalomania is a more apt diagnosis.
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Post by bulkey on Jun 29, 2021 13:51:51 GMT -5
Q has 3 more years left on his contract, paying him $750k/year (that's the published amount; who knows how much else?). He has had a lot more success than any previous coach of Syracuse WCBB, so I suspect this recent contract renewal has a very expensive buyout clause. Unless he can be fired for cause.... The allegations reported in The Athletic today are troubling. Based on the nature of these allegations, Syracuse University is engaging an outside firm to conduct an independent review and will take appropriate action based on its outcome. While no formal complaints have been made to date from members of the women’s basketball program, we take these allegations very seriously. We ask any individual who has knowledge of or has experienced this kind of conduct to come forward. Syracuse University remains focused on the well-being and success of our student-athletes.cnycentral.com/sports/college/the-athletic-syracuse-womens-basketball-coach-quentin-hillsman-accused-of-inappropriate-behaviorThis isn't the first time there's been complaints against Q (see above), and the fact that nearly the whole team transferred after this season should have been a clear sign to the AD to do something. That it took this report for any action just shows (once again) how corrupt Syracuse athletics is. |
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Post by rockymtblue2 on Jun 29, 2021 13:58:34 GMT -5
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Post by zoney on Jun 29, 2021 14:41:34 GMT -5
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Post by zoney on Jun 29, 2021 14:53:57 GMT -5
Because this board is all things UConn, it occasionally misses some minor details with other teams. This was one:
Emily Engstler, a 6-1 forward who was the ACC Co-Sixth Player of the Year, worked her ass off (literally and figuratively) to be in shape for the season. With Cardoso as a teammate - on paper at least - the Orange was putting together a fairly decent team. When Emily bailed out (before Kammy did) people took it at face value. But anybody who knows anything about her must have known something was seriously wrong. Where there's smoke there's fire. Denial alone doesn't change facts: Syracuse WCBB had turned into a steaming pile of dung and it HAD TO BE, absolutely HAD TO BE for one reason: because of the coach.
I'm actually surprised it took this long for this story to break..........
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Post by linkster on Jun 29, 2021 17:21:21 GMT -5
Sometimes smoke is all there is.
From the article:
Did Hillsman's program induce these suicidal thoughts or were these pre-existing conditions? I don't know what to think but forming conclusions based on the anonymous comments of disgruntled players isn't fair.
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Post by zoney on Jun 29, 2021 18:06:34 GMT -5
Hey linkster: good for you. I'm glad you're ready to defend him. Let's not be hasty now, right? The AD: “I totally support him. I support the values that he has for this program,” Wildhack said. “I support the standards that he holds everyone to, regardless of what your high school ranking was, or how good a player you are or how good a player you aren’t.” Hey linkster, you live in Syracuse? Do you live around Syracuse fans? Maybe when you go to Saturday Vigil Mass you see the Orange sweatshirts being proudly worn? Gotten a handle on what THEY'VE been thinking about Hillsman? Wellllllllll, I'm not a fireman but when I see smoke, when I smell smoke, when I'm choking on smoke, I'm bettin' there's a fire. www.syracuse.com/orangewomen/2021/06/former-syracuse-guard-kiara-fisher-announces-transfer-to-marist-college.html |
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Post by zoney on Jun 29, 2021 18:14:45 GMT -5
This will be my last post on this subject.
After I hit "enter" on my previous post I started thinking about the "Geno tripping incident."
Can you imagine a UConn player doing that to a head coach?
The mentality that would lead to something like that......where's it come from? The assistant coach handing out water bottles? Well I THINK I know where it comes from and probably so do you.
On this gem, I know EXACTLY where it came from: Denying Stewie her home game at the freakin' Carrier Dome. That was a big letter before G and letter before V directed at her, Geno, and the UConn team. It was a despicable act by an angry egotistical man.
AMAZING that some UConn fans may have forgotten those two incidents or are so willing to forgive.
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Post by linkster on Jun 29, 2021 21:02:13 GMT -5
Hey linkster: good for you. I'm glad you're ready to defend him. Let's not be hasty now, right? The AD: “I totally support him. I support the values that he has for this program,” Wildhack said. “I support the standards that he holds everyone to, regardless of what your high school ranking was, or how good a player you are or how good a player you aren’t.” Hey linkster, you live in Syracuse? Do you live around Syracuse fans? Maybe when you go to Saturday Vigil Mass you see the Orange sweatshirts being proudly worn? Gotten a handle on what THEY'VE been thinking about Hillsman? Wellllllllll, I'm not a fireman but when I see smoke, when I smell smoke, when I'm choking on smoke, I'm bettin' there's a fire. www.syracuse.com/orangewomen/2021/06/former-syracuse-guard-kiara-fisher-announces-transfer-to-marist-college.html I guess you have never been falsely accused or else you wouldn't be so quick to send someone to the gallows . I have never disliked Hillsman but I loved watching Moore scorch his team. And if all the egotistical asses coaching basketball were lined up there would be a ton of openings. I'll speculate here. When these reports appear and chronical years of alleged abuse I wonder "why now?". Maybe the school wants to move him out for any number of reasons so they informally get hold of some journalists and point them to transferees who maybe have complained and feed them all the background. Now the "report" is published and the school can say: It's just speculation but I wouldn't be surprised if all this is an excuse to can him for other reason(s). |
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Post by bulkey on Jun 29, 2021 22:22:34 GMT -5
Hey linkster: good for you. I'm glad you're ready to defend him. Let's not be hasty now, right? The AD: “I totally support him. I support the values that he has for this program,” Wildhack said. “I support the standards that he holds everyone to, regardless of what your high school ranking was, or how good a player you are or how good a player you aren’t.” Hey linkster, you live in Syracuse? Do you live around Syracuse fans? Maybe when you go to Saturday Vigil Mass you see the Orange sweatshirts being proudly worn? Gotten a handle on what THEY'VE been thinking about Hillsman? Wellllllllll, I'm not a fireman but when I see smoke, when I smell smoke, when I'm choking on smoke, I'm bettin' there's a fire. www.syracuse.com/orangewomen/2021/06/former-syracuse-guard-kiara-fisher-announces-transfer-to-marist-college.html I guess you have never been falsely accused or else you wouldn't be so quick to send someone to the gallows . I have never disliked Hillsman but I loved watching Moore scorch his team. And if all the egotistical asses coaching basketball were lined up there would be a ton of openings. I'll speculate here. When these reports appear and chronical years of alleged abuse I wonder "why now?". Maybe the school wants to move him out for any number of reasons so they informally get hold of some journalists and point them to transferees who maybe have complained and feed them all the background. Now the "report" is published and the school can say: It's just speculation but I wouldn't be surprised if all this is an excuse to can him for other reason(s). I've spent my entire life in the academy, at virtually every level, and I sometimes wish administrators were that clever, not for that purpose, but generally to be able to see around corners. But in fact, they generally react a beat too late. So, no, I'd be as genuinely shocked as much as Captain Renault was cynically so if they had exercised any foresight in this. Why now? There was a report accusing him of touching and abuse that got national attention. Isn't that reason enough for action? |
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Post by linkster on Jun 29, 2021 22:59:35 GMT -5
First, it was a news piece. Calling it a report gives it an air of being official. Second, action has been taken by the school. Is the fact that the news piece appeared in a national publication a sufficient reason to find him guilty in your mind. And third the article didn't accuse him of anything. The accusations come from former student athletes. I'd like to see the videos of their interviews. Lets see if they are willing to repeat their accusations to the firm investigating it instead of two young journalists with a hot story.
In my life there have been several instances of news being written about things I had a personal knowledge of and in every instance the article got important aspects of what happened wrong, most times to make the story juicier.
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Post by knightsbridgeaz on Jun 30, 2021 0:05:52 GMT -5
First, it was a news piece. Calling it a report gives it an air of being official. Second, action has been taken by the school. Is the fact that the news piece appeared in a national publication a sufficient reason to find him guilty in your mind. And third the article didn't accuse him of anything. The accusations come from former student athletes. I'd like to see the videos of their interviews. Lets see if they are willing to repeat their accusations to the firm investigating it instead of two young journalists with a hot story. In my life there have been several instances of news being written about things I had a personal knowledge of and in every instance the article got important aspects of what happened wrong, most times to make the story juicier. Having read the article it seemed fairly thoroughly researched, but yes, a whole bunch of folks could be lying. That said, it is an interesting mix of things. It really isn't more than mildly about sexual harassment - kissing players on the forehead is 100% inappropriate but there was only one player that said they didn't like being hugged. Largely it is about being a bit of a bully, really. It is pretty believable if you read the whole thing. I can 100% see that some players would not be bothered by what is in the article at all - but if even somewhat true I can see that some would be bothered. By todays standards, and really it should always have been (but wasn't), it is unacceptable to do things that can reasonably be expected to cause players to be upset. At the very least, it is a cautionary tale for players heading there. The non-ego parts of it (and they seem really likely, sadly) are - compared to some of the horror stories that commentators have trotted out - a bit less serious. But "less serious" doesn't mean that he should get a pass if he really told players he "didn't care about them" (I could care less about the profanity) or if he really has been kissing his players on the forehead. Which I swear I had heard somewhere before, by the way. |
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Post by swash on Jun 30, 2021 5:35:46 GMT -5
We've seen that he's egotistical and a bit creepy for years. There are kisses on the forehead and ... Kisses on the forehead. Hugs and ... Ughs.
Seems like if there were real sexual impropriety, the examples would have been more... Unambiguous.
swearing? Hardly unique in the coaching world.
Similar for Theatrical over-reactions and even table flipping
Q has bugged me for years. some specific complaints, but mostly a dislike I cannot pinpoint. On the one hand, this story feels like a slimy worm getting his due, but the complaints I have read aren't enough evidence to destroy a person and ruin a career... Yet.
Let's see where the investigation leads.
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Post by UConnChapette on Jun 30, 2021 9:39:42 GMT -5
I am of the mind to let the investigation play out. I don't like Quentin, but people can be destroyed by exaggerated claims. I am not saying AT ALL that the players are not right to feel what they feel. Their feelings are valid and need to be considered as such. This is a tricky thing to deal with.
I was once the victim of unwelcome attention that was on the borderline of outright sexual harrassment in the work place. Behavior was subtle, but the context was there and I felt very uncomfortable. I warned the co-worker his jokes and comments were not appreciated, yet her persisted. One day, he just went too far and I had enough. I took it to HR rather than let it go any further. I had the opportunity to determine this man's fate. HR made it clear that if I wanted to remove the sightline between my cube and his, they would move his desk location NOT mine. They even went so far as to say if I wanted him fired, that was within my power to voice that preference, and considering the fact I had warned him on more than one occasion was sufficient grounds for his termination. HR said I did everything right. I documented each action with date, time and witnesses; I laid out my case factually and unemotionally (which was exceedingly hard to do I must admit). In the end, I told them I just wanted him to be "reeducated" on the policy and to have him stop. It scared the bejeesus out of him, because he couldn't even make eye contact with me after that.
He would also rate all the women's clothing and appearance and call it out as they passed by: "Looking like an 8 today, Karen", "Only a 6 today, Lynn". I mentioned it in my complaint to HR, but that wasn't the focus of my complaint. Just additional evidence that he was making many people uncomfortable, not just me.
This man was just a Neanderthal, and a bigot to boot. He "complimented" a female member of the department to her face as "being very smart - for one of your kind" (she was black). We had a member of the department of Indian descent. He referred to him as "towel head" behind his back - and Taj wasn't a Sikh so there wasn't any turban! If you were not a white Protestant or Catholic male, you were fair game for belittling. He also had a very low opinion of Jewish people, of which we had several in the department. The next time there was a reduction in force, he was shown the door.
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Post by vtcwbuff on Jun 30, 2021 10:34:46 GMT -5
Trust me when I say that I am not a Hillsman fan. One poster described him as a popinjay and another as pompous. I would use a different P word to describe him. I would have no problem if he were fired - if it was warranted.
Unfortunately, news media and fan boards are all too quick to condemn. Allegations have been made but from what I have read so far none of them seem to be serious enough to cause the sort of player exodus that we saw. So I'm waiting for the investigation conclusions and hopefully the truth of the situation will become known.
Profanity - non starter there. Ever listen to player's conversations?
Touching - Upper pelvis? Is that like putting your hand on a player's hip?
Yelling that you don't care about them- That's a tough one. I can see the wet spots from the melted snowflakes.
Kissed on the forehead - did they bend down so that he could reach their forehead? Kinda' creepy but enough to destroy a man's career?
What did I miss?
The thing that bothered me was that apparently 3 players said that Hillsman's behavior caused them to have suicidal thoughts! That almost looked like a pre arranged accusation (conspiracy anyone?)or it was the result of prompting by the interviewer.
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Post by bulkey on Jun 30, 2021 10:35:51 GMT -5
I agree that the investigation needs to play out. Syracuse renewed his contract a couple of years back, with high praise, so they are certainly not interested in firing him without cause. I predict the outside consultants will acknowledge inappropriate, but not irremediable or illegal, actions, and so he'll be kept on with a warning. Unless he tosses a chair across the court before that, three years from now, they just won't renew him. And that's because he'll no longer be able to recruit the type of quality players that will keep Syracuse competitive in what is becoming a very competitive ACC conference in WCBB. cuse.com/news/2018/7/12/syracuse-extends-contract-for-womens-basketball-head-coach-quentin-hillsman.aspx |
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Post by vtcwbuff on Jun 30, 2021 10:37:00 GMT -5
Trust me when I say that I am not a Hillsman fan. One poster described him as a popinjay and another as pompous. I would use a different P word to describe him. I would have no problem if he were fired - if it was warranted.
Unfortunately, news media and fan boards are all too quick to condemn. Allegations have been made but from what I have read so far none of them seem to be serious enough to cause the sort of player exodus that we saw. So I'm waiting for the investigation conclusions and hopefully the truth of the situation will become known.
Profanity - non starter there. Ever listen to player's conversations?
Touching - Upper pelvis? Is that like putting your hand on a player's hip?
Yelling that you don't care about them- That's a tough one. I can see the wet spots from the melted snowflakes.
Kissed on the forehead - did they bend down so that he could reach their forehead? Kinda' creepy but enough to destroy a man's career?
What did I miss?
The thing that bothered me was that apparently 3 players said that Hillsman's behavior caused them to have suicidal thoughts! That almost looked like a pre arranged accusation (conspiracy anyone?)or it was the result of prompting by the interviewer.
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